| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| Vera |
Posted - 19/03/2008 : 18:41:38
Hi all!
Douggie kindly contacted Carole and forwarded us an interview he did several years ago. Some of us might already have read it - but due to the fact that we have a lot of new members who are very interested in Dusty (Alex!  ) we thought it might be nice idea to post it again. So in this way enjoy! 
Thank you so much for making this available Douggie!
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Perhaps you could give us some history on The Echoes – for example, how did The Dynamos become The Echoes?
The Echoes were formed in early 1959 by singer Chris Wayne for the Conway Twitty, Johnny Preston and Freddy Canon tour of Great Britain.
I was not with The Echoes for this tour but with another group Sonny Stewart and the Dynamos. The Dynamos were a very good group and did a lot of work on US Airbases. We often performed on Saturday Club for The BBC.
In 1960, there was some unrest with Sonny Stewart and his management, so it was decided to part company. Sonny formed another group and The Dynamos went off to find other work. It was at this time that I met up again with Laurie Jay who I had known from my time working at the 2I's coffee bar in Old Compton Street Laurie was a drummer and leader of the Echoes. They had a bit of a problem Chris had a tour coming up with Gene Vincent and the only remaining Echo was Laurie. He wanted The Dynamos apart from the drummer to be The Echoes for this tour. There were a few agents who had worked for The Dynamos but the jobs were a couple of months away so it seemed the right thing for the group to do at that time. So The Dynamos became The Echoes to accompany Gene Vincent when he visited Britain at the beginning of 1960.
The line up of this group was Laurie Jay (drums), Tony Collins (guitar), Les Smith (piano) and Douggie Reece (bass). This tour was extremely successful and offers of work flowed in for The Echoes and, with so much interest in The Echoes, all the plans for The Dynamos stopped. The group became The Echoes forever and continued to back Gene Vincent on most of his tours of Britain, as well a lots of other artists. Chris Wayne left the group in mid 1960.
From left: Douggie (bass), Garry Boyle (guitar), Jimmy O'Brien (keyboards) and Peter Wolf (drums)
I understand you came to know of Dusty when she was still with the Lana Sisters – how did this come about?
We used to do lots of US Airbases both as The Dynamos and latter as The Echoes. As the Dynamos we would play music for the US airmen to dance to, but during the evening there would also be a floorshow or cabaret act.
Lots of acts would do these bases, comics, singers and all sorts including The Lana Sisters. The Echoes would do both - a dance group and sometimes a floorshow. This is how it would have come about. Even though I wouldn’t have gone up to her and said “Hi I’m Doug”. At the time Dusty was just part of another floorshow act. I am about 9 months younger than Dusty, so we were either about 18 or 19 at the time. There were no flashes of lightning or bells (but maybe she never told me). But I do remember meeting all the girls including Shan…. Which was her name while she was with the Lana Sisters.
You auditioned to play for Dusty. What can you tell us about this?
Granada Kennington 1963. Even though this is true, apart from one other audition The Echoes never needed to audition. We were a very well established group way before Dusty went solo or before The Springfields were formed. The Echoes did lots of touring with some of the biggest artists in Britain from 1960. We had released three singles had our own fan club and we did Sunday Night at The London Palladium with Bert Weedon in 1961. We were one of three or four Rock ’n’ Roll groups to have done The Palladium at this time. We were a very good backing group. We also did records with other artists, radio and television. I mention this about the audition so that you have an idea that to audition for anybody was something that The Echoes would otherwise not have done. The only other time was when Mike Collier who was a record producer wanted to hear us for his productions. We did loads of records for him including our own records.
Anyway after a heavy workload and a summer season in Jersey 1963, Tommy, the drummer of the group, decided to stay on the island for a while. By staying he missed all of the bookings we had and also the audition for Dusty. So we had a stand in drummer and also keyboard player. Ray had told me the night before the audition that he was leaving to go back to Scotland. I think that there must have been a lot of pressure on the guys. I tried not to panic so I got another keyboard player Mick and drummer Martin to fill in for the audition. Dusty arrived with some music we spoke for a while then we played for her. I think we all went and had tea and sandwiches after the audition then she went away. Latter I had a call from my agent George Cooper who said that she liked the group but Martin did not play the right style of drums for her. He knew that he was only a stand in and that Tommy would be back from Jersey really soon. Tommy never came back in time for the rehearsals so another drummer had to be found and he was Bob Wackett.
The Echoes had been doing a lot of recordings for Mike Collier (an independent record producer) and his arranger was Al Saxon, who had a hit in 1959 with Only Sixteen, who, I believe, was a friend of Dusty’s. He may have told Dusty about us! I’m not really sure!!!
You clearly worked with Dusty for some time, how would you describe Dusty’s approach to her music?
She had one of the best record collections I had seen at the time. Even though she didn’t really look after them, not always putting them back in the sleeves. I think that she brought most of them when she went to the States on one of her song searching missions. This is why she was so aware of what was happening overseas music-wise. She was not content just to wait for one of the British record companies to release something, or give her American song to cover. She would go to the publishers in New York, find songs and buy records to listen to when she got back to Britain.
Dusty out and about in 1964
In the early days I would go around to where she lived and we would talk lots, not just about music but lots of things, listen to lots and lots of tracks. Some that she liked some that I liked. She would point out things that caught her ear, and I would try to remember what she liked so that it could be put into practice with the Echoes. She would sometimes make notes about different tracks or songs she liked either to record or play on stage. She gave me quite a few records to take home to listen too. I have still got them. After most of these sessions, which could have gone on for most of the night, we would go to The Golden Egg in Oxford Street or drive out to the airport to watch the planes, have scrabbled eggs, crunchy bacon, toast with butter and tea. I can still taste them - fantastic!!
What would you say you learned from Dusty? What did Dusty learn from you?
She taught me how to make great scrambled eggs!! She did!! Also, I would say Dusty taught me to listen properly. She would say at these listening nights: “How about that bass line!!”, “What a great drum fill!!”, “Gee!! The brass is loud or a bit out of tune!” or “Beautiful strings!!” This helped give me the ability to separate the sounds that you hear on records. She had great ears. I don’t mean like an elephant, but ears that could distinguish minute differences in musical pitch.
It was because of this ability that a lot of musicians worried. Not that she could tell them how to play or what was wrong, she just knew that it was not how it should be. She also had a great rhythm feel and sang with tons of emotion. That’s why a lot of tracks she recorded weren’t released. She had to at least like it. If something was not quite right or it didn’t feel right it was shelved. Some were released later as most of you are aware. There were also tracks done that she loved that weren’t released because the record company had other ideas.
We understood one another very well, on top of being very good friends. She just trusted me. I think we may have known each other in a former life!
A typically sharp, topical newspaper cartoon from JAK gives an indication of the controversy that the tour caused
You were with Dusty as part of the Echoes during her South African tour, is that right? What is your take on this famed episode in Dusty’s career?
Yes I was there! Nobody went there to make any trouble. It was just another tour. There was a contract that said we would play to a mixed audience of white and black people. Both purchased Dusty’s records so they should be able to see her perform. There were no problems for the first show, and everybody seemed to enjoy it. It was when we went back to the hotel later that night that the government got involved. They wanted to change the contract. They wanted a new contract to say we would play to segregated audiences. Vic Billings refused saying that our original contract was fine.
It came to a head in Cape Town. We were told that we had to go home to England. The day of departure we were pick up at the hotel and taken to the airport under armed guard. Everything that happened was in the papers so everybody knew. At the airport our luggage was taken to the plane, and we had to walk across the tarmac to the DC10. All the black porters wore dark blue boiler suits and red berets formed two lines for us to walk between for us to board the plane. As we passed they all took off their berets smiled and nodded. It was one of those moments that you never forget. I know I never will.
Tell us about touring with Dusty, what was this like? How was Dusty on tour?
It was very exciting! How could it not be! One of the best singers in the world in front of a great band of musicians, and singers playing really great songs and great arrangements. Dusty always sang with all the energy she had. So she had to relax as much as she could - hence no driving. Dusty’s live performances were always Great!!!
Dusty always looked a million dollars on stage. The atmosphere was electric and audience were there for her. They always loved her gowns and all the songs.
We often read of Dusty being ‘firm’ and ‘difficult’ and all the associated antics with such stories, what’s your take on this?
Not with me! Nor with the Echoes or any who toured with us. She knew want she wanted. Some people tried to take advantage of her because they thought that she was just another female singer. She was not just another singer. A perfectionist, yes! She wanted things to be right for her, the show and for the audience.
How was Dusty prior to a performance?
Most of the time she would sit quietly in the dressing room doing her makeup and her vocal exercises. She never really did too much talking before the show. She would just make sure that everybody knew what to do. She sometimes worried about whether her voice would hold up and would maybe drop a song or two if she felt her voice wasn’t good.
Dusty has described herself as a ‘wreck’ after a performance, how would you describe her?
After the show she would be wrecked but she’d get herself together. Then she would sign autographs and see the fans. They were very special to her. She would make time for them even if she weren’t feeling the best. Sometimes we would go out for a meal. Or have tea and sandwiches at the hotel.
What stories can you tell us about working with Dusty?
Where does one begin!
There’s the time we were working at The Talk of the North for Joe Pullen, who owned it. A good club, but a small stage. The Echoes at the time had brass and percussion, with eight people in the band and Dusty would be out the front. Jimmy O’Brien played keyboards (electric keyboard and a grand piano). He took up a large part of the stage, which was fine. Until the brass players come on the other side of the stage and decided that they wanted just a bit more room. So Derek Andrews, who played second trumpet, thought he would just give the grand piano a little shove to achieve this. He didn’t know that the piano was right on the edge of the stage. With his little shove it flipped over onto the floor, with the legs of the grand piano pointing upwards to the ceiling like a dead fly.
Luckily there were no tables or people where it landed. Joe Pullen wasn’t very happy. But the sound was perfect for Dusty. Who just laughed and laughed on hearing the grand piano hitting the floor. I wish that I had a recorder at the time as the sound was priceless. Dusty laughed so much that all her mascara she had on for the show just ran all down her face.
I wish I had a camera, the picture would have been priceless. The show was delayed for a while to fix up the piano and also Dusty’s makeup.
On 5 July 1965 you sang Mockingbird with Dusty on the BBC’s Saturday Club. What can you tell us about that performance? I understand you sang this song live with Dusty many times, what can you tell us about this?
Dusty would always try and include us [The Echoes] in what she did. Doing a duet would give the show a bit more colour. We did this song in most of the shows before and after this date.
She did Got to Run with us because she liked the song and what we had done with it, and wanted to try and help The Echoes get a hit. It was a good record. Later Dusty did a duet with Garry Boyle on stage, the song was I Can’t Stand It The version we did was done by Betty Everett & Jerry Butler originally.
Dusty and Douggie singing a duet, probably Mockingbird, at Tito's Club, Stockton on Tees, Nov/Dec 1965
You played for Dusty on her TV shows. What memories do you have of this? What were Dusty’s feelings about these TV shows?
A lot of work. I had to co ordinate all the music, find arrangements or get them done. But it felt good when the shows came together. I think that she liked them. I am sure that there were things she didn’t like, but she never really said. Playing on them
was great.
You left The Echoes and moved to Australia in the early seventies, much the same time as Dusty left the UK for the USA. Was there a connection?
In a way there was! Dusty had spoken to me about a few things. After all the touring and recording I think that she started to get a bit down. I don’t think that she could see herself doing a summer season in Great Yarmouth then a tour and a pantomime at Christmas. Which seems to be how things are in Britain. She had captured most of the world with her vocal abilities but for her career she needed to have more recognition in the States. She thought that she had to go there to do it. I didn’t think this was the case, but I was a friend not her manager. She had had some success without being there and I think she could have had more without leaving Britain. Dusty was always impressed with things American, cars, songwriters, producers and singers. She always thought they were better and because of this she had a bit of a complex about who she was and her abilities. She just had to go.
Dusty was doing a lot of work that did not involve The Echoes. I still did work with her but not always with the group. As she was not touring as much and The Echoes did lots of work with other artists. Including John Rowles, who had just had a hit with If I only Had Time. So The Echoes still had lots work, but Dusty was off to the states. I saw Dusty in LA for a week or so on my way home from touring Australia/New Zealand with John. She seemed great, happy and bright, the same as ever. She had not been doing any singing but she was fine.
Ever since we toured Australia in 1964, I knew that one day I would live there. My decision to move came after John was asked to move to Hawaii to sing. I had by this time met Wendy who I married in 1971. Wendy sang with her sisters Margaret and Beverly and another girl called Marcie. They are called Marcie and The Cookies. Which is really cleaver as Wendy’s surname is Cook. They had come from Australia to Britain to work the clubs. With Dusty gone to the states and John gone to the states it just seemed I should go to Australia. I had been there a lot of times and had some very good contacts. And Wendy wanted to take me home to Australia as a souvenir from Britain.
What stories of Dusty’s time in the US did you hear and how did they make you feel?
I did hear lots of stories of her time there. I was very upset about what I heard and I wished that I could have been there for her. She had lost her security base. She had always had people around her who understood her. I think had Dusty stayed in Britain, or taken Pat or me or both of us with her, a lot of the things that happened to her just would not have happened.
Everything was just too sad. Just tragic! I think America can do that to people. I would have gone there if I thought I could have stopped everything that happened. I still get very upset about it!
Dusty and Douggie chatting about music, as they so often did!
Did you lose all contact with Dusty at this time? Was this contact reinstated at any time and if so, how?
I did lose personal contact with Dusty but I sometimes got little notes written on letters I received from Pat, who I didn’t lose contact with.
I did see her when she came to Melbourne to do a corporate show at the Hilton. Fred Perry was with her. I was working at a Television station then. I had a phone call at the station and a voice said “The coach is leaving in 10 minutes”. I knew straight away who it was. It was Fred he used to call every morning and say these words while we were on tour all those years ago. I went right away to see her and Fred. We spent hours talking.
The band she had for this show was OK, But it would not have been the band if I had been involved. She also didn’t have an MD. I also saw her in 1983 in LA. With Wendy and my two boys we had gone back to England for Christmas, on our way back to Melbourne we did the Disney Land thing. We caught up with Fred who drove us everywhere and we had dinner with Dusty.
It was really great to see her again, but she wasn’t quite the same. I had heard all the stories and could tell she was really pleased to see us but she was also very sad inside. After all the time that I had known her and all the things that we had spoken about and done, I just knew that things weren’t right or good for her, she was unhappy. I tried to think of what I could do to help. We came back to Australia and quite a while later was happy to hear that she was going back to England. I thought “she will be fine now”.
What was your observation of Dusty’s relationship with Vicki Wickham?
I tried to think of what I could do to help Dusty to get herself together. I had a solution. I was doing well in Melbourne working at Channel Nine, doing record production, arranging music, playing with a group and also directing the Orchestra at the Melbourne Concert Hall for some shows. The people financed and put on these show wanted to do something really special. They wanted to put on a big star. Money was no object providing that it was a star. Guess who I suggested?
I called Pat and told her she said I would have to talk to Vicki. I did not know that Vicki was involved at all. So Pat gave me all the numbers for Vicki, I called several times left messages, said what it was about. I never heard back. This show would have been in all the major concert halls in Australia. Dusty would have made a lot of money and maybe regained some of her confidence, which I felt she had lost. I had known Vicki since she was the producer on Ready Steady Go. I also knew that she had something to do with La Belle. If she was any kind of “manager” or friend she should have returned my calls even to say get lost. I never told Dusty of this, I just thought I shouldn’t make waves.
Years earlier, I thought of her as a producer of a television show who was friendly with Dusty and also with me. I never dreamt she would become Dusty’s manager. Vic Billings was the best manager Dusty ever had. She should have kept him. I don’t know what Dusty thought of Vicki. But Dusty was nobody’s fool. She could read people.
I am not sure if she really trusted her. On one of the TV shows after Dusty had passed on, Vicki said something that really offended me. Vicki stated that Dusty only sang for the money. I was hurt by this remark, as it was not so. There were many times when Dusty ended up with less money than band after some of the shows. She wanted the shows to sound, look and be good so everything had to be paid for. Her gowns were fabulous but would have cost Dusty a lot of money. The money artists made back then was nothing like they are paid these days. Dusty had lots of hits and was very popular but would have made lots less than maybe The Spice Girls or Kylie.
With Penny Valentine, Vicki came to write Dancing With Demons. What are your feelings on this book?
My feelings were much the same as everybody else’s. Penny Valentine sent me a list of questions to answer. I sent back 14 pages of answers of which she must have used one. I thought she was also a friend of Dusty’s and would write a book that would have been worthy of that.
No friend would have written this book. They are not friends. It was a money making project for themselves. Friends should be able to trust one another.
What were your feelings when Dusty was promoting her work after you The Echoes disbanded? Did you miss being part of her career?
We all have to do what we can to survive. I had to make a decision about my career, which I felt was in Australia. I have not regretted that decision. Dusty did what she felt was right for her career. There was never any animosity between us. We respected the others point of view. I did miss her and our long talks. I missed our time together and I did miss being part of her career.
What were your feelings when Dusty stormed the charts with What Have I Done To Deserve This with the Pet Shop Boys?
I thought that it was great that she was able to get some things happening again. I did hear the tracks she did with Richard Carpenter which I quite liked. The Pet Shop Boys stuff was new for Dusty and it was good. I have been into sequenced music for a while, so I knew where they were coming from.
Did you have an enduring friendship with Dusty and if so, what can you tell us about this?
Yes, we were very, very good friends. I have said it before - I never had an argument with Dusty. We understood one another. We shared lots of good times lots had of fun and lots of great music. We also shared some bad and sad times.
I was her friend yesterday, I am still her friend today and I will be her friend tomorrow. I just loved her!
How would you describe Dusty’s contribution to the world of music? Do you feel she has obtained the respect she deserves?
Not fully. I know that she’s in the hall of fame, but listening to the radio here in Australia, she had so many records it is a shame that a lot more of her music is not heard as much as it could be.
She should be held in very high esteem, especially in Great Britain. She was the best female singer ever in Great Britain. I should know, I worked with most of them. I did read that we should try and do an Elvis with one of her tracks. Could be good. I’ll have a think about it. It’s not as hard as you think.
Tell us a little about your life now!
I married Wendy in 1971. My eldest son is Shannon, he is 28 and a very good singer, great sense of humour. Martin is in the middle, he is 26, a very good guitar and bass player, does a lot of painting on canvas - they are all over the house. Gemma is 15 and very good at Netball and Volley ball. Her team has just become state champions. Wendy still sings with her sisters and they are great.
Dusty liked Wendy they got along very well. She would have liked what they did as it was the same sort of things that Dusty liked. Black Soul Music.
I still play bass and sing in a group. Not as much as I used to. I think that is the way of the music business now. I still do shows with John Rowles when he comes to town. I do a lot of arranging but mainly on the computer now, I have a lot of sound modules and things and make backing tracks. I started to do some of Dusty’s songs but I have to keep stopping to do other things. I am doing a book, about my life, It’s very time consuming. It’s from when I was little during the war, my schooldays, working, where I lived, moving into the music industry, people I met and those that I worked with, including Dusty, John coming to Australia and the things and people here. But it all takes time.
Trying to win the lottery. I have a couple of things coming up. I hope that they do. It will be good.
You’ve just joined the Dusty Community – what do you make of this crazy on-line community?
I think it’s good. I really don’t know how it works yet, but I’ll get there. I see a lot of things that I can help with, questions and such. I have to find out how to send things to them. Like attachments, photos, maybe some tracks. I hope to get to know them all.
What is your abiding memory of Dusty?
Who loves you, baby??????
(c/o Kojak television show)
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| 6 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| pandy063 |
Posted - 06/05/2008 : 17:17:13
Thank you Douggie, Vera and Carole for making this interview available. I so enjoyed it.
pandy063
Guess Who? |
| Lindakron |
Posted - 20/03/2008 : 16:40:38
Thank you SO MUCH! Fantastic pictures, too. It's my lucky day, first this interview and then my BBC DVD appeared in my mailbox.  .
Why didn't I know her name was Shan when she was with the Lana Sisters? How confusing! I don't think I could handle so many name changes without forgetting who I am. 
x - Linda - x |
| Janie |
Posted - 20/03/2008 : 16:34:16
This is a wonderful contribution - my grateful thanks to you Douggie for giving us the opportunity to see this interview again.
Janie x54 |
| Carole R. |
Posted - 20/03/2008 : 15:25:55
Thanks to Douggie for sending us this unique Interview.
Its really interesting and gives us a 'behind the scenes' glimpse of the woman and star that was Dusty Springfield.
I absolutely love the photograph of Dusty and Douggie looking at the sheet music, it looks so completely natural...She suits those glasses doesn't she?..
Carole R xx
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| treking |
Posted - 19/03/2008 : 23:53:56
It was really nice of Douggie to dig this out for us.
Its nice to read it again.
Enjoy, those of you who haven't seen it before
Trek
Also known as Carole. |
| Carla |
Posted - 19/03/2008 : 22:00:13
Wooow thank you Vera for putting this up for us newbies...i thoroughly enjoyed reading it.
Must admit i never heard the name of his band before, but i was a lil nipper when his band was formed. 
Louise xx
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